Changeset: 140168863
Create KMB 89D in Hong Kong
Closed by samho1234567
Tags
changesets_count | 734 |
---|---|
created_by | iD 2.27.1 |
host | https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit |
imagery_used | Bing Maps Aerial |
locale | zh-TW |
resolved:outdated_tags:incomplete_tags | 7 |
warnings:outdated_tags:noncanonical_brand | 7 |
Discussion
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Comment from Patrickov
Just curious, I found the "name" tag of your routes a bit inconsistent. Sometimes you use alternate Chinese / English notations (i.e. Chinese start / English start / Chinese end / English end), other times you use full Chinese and then full English.
Which one do you think is better?
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Comment from samho1234567
Yet it is confusing of bilingual name of bus route. I don't know if there is a consensus on bilingual name in Hong Kong OSM community.
Example 1: 九巴89D線 (藍田站 → 烏溪沙站) KMB 89D (Lam Tin Station → Wu Kai Sha Station)
Example 2: 九巴89D線 KMB 89D (藍田站 Lam Tin Station → 烏溪沙站 Wu Kai Sha Station)
I would prefer Example 1 (full Chinese and then full English). This one is more popular. Example 2 (Chinese start / English start / Chinese end / English end) seems to be adopted in historical edition. I would edit the name to be consistent very soon.
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Comment from Patrickov
When I first edited I also observed Example 2, but eventually I found example 1 slightly easier to manage.
Since some more prominent early contributors (e.g. 小智智) had emigrated, I'd say we could seek a new consensus among ourselves. From your response I believe that we have already reached one ;)
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Comment from Kovoschiz
I would like to remind this is bad style anyway. It's Tagging For editing software, inconvenient for applications to show route name and directions separately. iD already supports generating labels from `from=` and `to=` , as well as `network=` . https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Buses#Bus_Route_Naming
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Comment from Patrickov
@Kovoschiz I only concerned human readability. Editing software probably won't give a damn on either.
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Comment from Patrickov
@Kovoschiz Frankly I don't think either of these 2 are the best anyway. What do you think?
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Comment from Kovoschiz
It just works poorly in long descriptive cases.
6 https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/9383262 https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/6517616
89D https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/16227456
There are 114 `route=bus` with `name=` longer than 100 chars. These 5 exceeds 150 chars.
682C https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/1290051 https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/1317095
HZMB (because tri-lingual) https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/8858065 https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/8858068
788 https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/10866299 https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/10866300 -
Comment from Kovoschiz
What I do is move this label to `description=` . Use `name=` for company and route number only, similar to the Schedule of Routes. The direction can be obtained in `from=` and `to=`. That's why I add `from:*=` and `to:*=` languages.
In the status quo, it is common to have `name:en=` and `name:zh=`, but not for `from=` and `to=` .
It is very tedious to update routes when you put all the info in `name=` . I said screw it when I have to update Tuen Ma Line and East Rail Line -
Comment from Patrickov
@Kovoschiz That's what I do for route_masters. For the routes themselves, though, it's preferable to have at least something to distinguish between them, I suppose? I can't expect editors to be so smart, especially when they use tools like iD (okay, maybe that's what you mean by "tagging for editing software"?)
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Comment from Patrickov
(by 'editors' I mean people like us)
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Comment from samho1234567
For the tagging issue, I have no opinion on it. I leave it to you guys to amend my previous submissions if necessary.
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Comment from Patrickov
@samho1234567 No worries, it's not a personal matter. If we can come to a consensus and adapt accordingly, then what we have done will become examples for others to come.
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Comment from Kovoschiz
As linked, this situation has been specifically called out for how bad it is, in need of a clean up. It should not be encouraged.
https://github.com/osm-search/Nominatim/issues/413
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Homonymous_keys#Incompatible_formats
Besides, `name=` is the common name. In this thinking, you would say eg "KMB Route 89D Towards Wu Kai Sha", as in the bus broadcast. So even if you want to include redundant non-proper-name info, it is debatable whether you need the origin, arrows, and brackets. -
Comment from Kovoschiz
In `=hiking` / `=foot`, it doesn't need to be `name:en=Wilson Trail Section 3 (Lam Tin — Tseng Lan Shue)` either.
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Comment from Patrickov
If that's the case maybe we hold a meeting or such with other contributors in Hong Kong?
Ways (18)
- 1200765384, v1
- 石門交匯處 Shek Mun Interchange (1200765385), v1
- 1200765386, v1
- 1200765387, v1
- 1200765388, v1
- 1200765389, v1
- 88088441, v11
- 西沙路 Sai Sha Road (150664463), v12
- 西沙路 Sai Sha Road (150664464), v11
- 石門交匯處 Shek Mun Interchange (254038381), v8
- 大老山公路 Tate's Cairn Highway (254836598), v16
- 觀塘道 Kwun Tong Road (435953761), v13
- 742034933, v5
- 鯉魚門道 Lei Yue Mun Road (987703101), v3
- 太子道東 Prince Edward Road East (992301919), v2
- 太子道東 Prince Edward Road East (992301925), v3
- 觀塘道 Kwun Tong Road (1133472559), v2
- 觀塘道 Kwun Tong Road (1134206881), v2
Relations (1-20 of 22)
- 1
- 2
- 九巴89D線 KMB 89D (藍田站 Lam Tin Station → 烏溪沙站 Wu Kai Sha Station) (16226412), v1
- 九巴89D線 KMB 89D (烏溪沙站 Wu Kai Sha Station → 藍田站 Lam Tin Station) (16226413), v1
- 九巴89D線 KMB 89D (16226414), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (16226415), v1
- Bus 680 (Ma On Shan (Lee On Estate) - Admiralty (East)) (2456435), v120
- Bus 682 (Ma On Shan (Lee On Estate) - Chai Wan (East)) (3507254), v100
- 九巴99線 KMB 99 (西貢 Sai Kung → 恆安 Heng On) (6463271), v29
- 九巴99線 KMB 99 (恆安 Heng On → 西貢 Sai Kung) (6464475), v29
- 九巴99線 KMB 99 (西貢 Sai Kung → 恆安 Heng On (不經沙角尾 omit Sha Kok Mei)) (6464476), v28
- 九巴99線 KMB 99 (恆安 Heng On → 西貢 Sai Kung (不停西貢警署 skip Sai Kung Police Station)) (6464477), v29
- 九巴299X線 KMB 299X (西貢 Sai Kung → 沙田市中心 Sha Tin Central) (6464508), v42
- 九巴299X線 KMB 299X (西貢 Sai Kung → 沙田市中心 Sha Tin Central (經沙角尾 via Sha Kok Mei)) (6464510), v42
- 九巴263A線 KMB 263A (香港科學園 Hong Kong Science Park → 屯門站 Tuen Mun Station) (8400375), v57
- 九巴289R線 KMB 289R (黃石碼頭 Wong Shek Pier → 沙田市中心 Sha Tin Central) (12012606), v20
- 九巴38B線(海濱花園→碩門邨) KMB 38B (Riviera Gardens -> Shek Mun Estate) (14179372), v33
- 城巴B8線 Citybus B8 (香園圍口岸 Heung Yuen Wai Port → 大圍站 Tai Wai Station) (15978473), v14
- 藍田公共運輸交匯處 Lam Tin Public Transport Interchange (16113208), v4
- 九巴43X線(馬鞍山(耀安)→荃灣西站) KMB 43X (Ma On Shan (Yiu On) → Tsuen Wan West Station) (16129460), v5
- 九巴43X線(保泰街→荃灣西站) KMB 43X (Po Tai Street → Tsuen Wan West Station) (16130993), v3
- 烏溪沙站公共運輸交匯處 Wu Kai Sha Station Public Transport Interchange (16213522), v2
Nodes (1-20 of 35)
- 1
- 2
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699158), v2
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699162), v2
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699165), v2
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699170), v2
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699179), v3
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699180), v3
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (2640699185), v3
518263126, v5- 11133588939, v1
- 11133588940, v1
- 11133588941, v1
- 11133588942, v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588943), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588944), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588945), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588946), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588947), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588948), v1
- 福安花園 Fok On Garden (11133588949), v1
- 11133588950, v1
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